Half-Price Book find: Complete Book of Necromancers

In the waning days of 2nd ed and before 3rd ed was out there was a golden time of ebay sales of older books.

Golden that is if you were a seller.

One such book that went for outrageous prices was the 2nd Ed, Complete Book of Necromancers.  

I had bought this book back in 1995 or so for the cover price.  I held on to it and really enjoyed having it.  Nothing makes for a great arch-villain like a necromancer.  In early 2000 I sold it, along with a ton of my AD&D 2nd Ed. Material on eBay.   I got $83 for that book alone.  Not a bad deal really.

Since that time I have not really thought about that book much other than to gloat on making $65 profit on it.  Sure there were times I wanted to flip through it again, but I had new 3rd Edition material to keep me busy.

Well yesterday at Half-Price books I found another copy.  It was in very good condition and despite the name of the store it was going for $14.00.  Sure they are not fetching much more than 40 on ebay these days either.

Well I own a copy again and happy to have it.  

Reading through it I was caught up in the world of WP and NWP and THAC0 all over again, but the fluff is still great.  Not sure I'll ever actually use it, but it is there now next to my 3e and 4e books of similar nature.

Quintessential D&D (Half-baked ideas), Part 2

So building off of my "Half-Baked Adventure" and my sorta-update here is a plan.

Here is what I have at the moment.

Basic:  B1 In Search of the Unknown
AD&D 1^st Ed: C2 Ghost Tower of Inverness
AD&D 2^nd Ed: RM4 House of Strahd. Total cheat I know, but I'd run it as if it were in Ravenloft.
D&D 3^rd Ed: Expedition to the Ruins of Greyhawk
D&D 4^th Ed: The updated Tomb of Horrors

So some remakes and updates.  But all with classic roots.
Now to buy a copy of Expedition to the Ruins of Greyhawk.

Could WotC support ALL D&D?

There is an interesting post on Wizard's site today where Mike Mearls discusses (basically) gaming style and which version of D&D best fits that style.
http://www.wizards.com/DnD/Article.aspx?x=dnd/4ll/20110614#74972

It is worth a read and reminds me a bit of the old GNS Theory that was so popular a few years back.

I am not going to get into whether or not X version of Y game fits where on Mearls grid or even Edward's GNS.
I don't particularly care about those sorts of things since they all take a back seat to the more important questions to me: "Is Game X fun?  Will I have fun with Game X?  Do I own Game X so I can find out on my own?"

Which gets me to my random though of the day.

Should WotC support ALL D&D?  

As a business model it is a flawed one, the cost to produce physical products for a game that is 10, 20 or even 30 years out of print is pointless.  But what about using their own electronic distribution?

Recently WotC has seemed open to print 1st and even 2nd and 3rd Edition related material.  Why not take that that a step further and offer a "Classic D&D" subscription.  You pay (or maybe it is part of the DDI) and get new material for your game.

Of course readers of this blog will see the error right away.  There are a ton of blogs out there now, producing for free or very, very cheap, material for those older games.  And thanks to the OGL WotC (unlike TSR in the past) is perfectly happy that we continue to do so.

But what WotC adds to the mix is something we as a group do not have.  Brand recognition.  I can say "my magic hats is for people that ply Basic Era games" (nudge nudge wink wink implied).   Only WotC can say "this is for you people that still love to play Basic Dungeons & Dragons".

Obviously there is cost.  Someone has to write and that someone has to be paid.  Art is a very important part of what WotC can bring to the table that a simple blogger or one-man shop can't do as well or as cheaply.  Of course art is still not cheap.

I am sure that a cost benefit analysis would need to be done.  How much would it cost versus how much return they could get.

So let me throw it all out to you.

Would you pay WotC for regular content for your particular favorite Old School D&D product?
How much would you pay?
Per product or monthly?
What would you want to see to make you seriously consider this?

Now keep in mind this is NOT market research.  You all are not a random sample. You are a sample that is used to get a lot of material free (if not her, then other places) but you are also a sample that is interested in this older games AND a sample that is open to other games.  You read my blog afterall, I talk about a dozen or so different games here and about a half dozen on a regular basis.  You answers are different than those of say the regular reader of Dragonsfoot or Grognardia or ENWorld.

Let me, and the world, know what you think.

I'm with D&D

This is not a big surprise.

I saw this banner again today on Christian Lindke's Cinerati blog about to uselessness of edition wars. The image is from TheWeem.com and it is to support D&D, any D&D, any edition.  Even if your D&D is actually called Basic Fantasy, S&W or Pathfinder.

Enjoy your game!

Clerics in D&D

There has been a lot of talk of clerics and their value in a D&D game.  This ranges from the the old school of whether or not the Cleric is an appropriate trope for a fantasy game to the new school of whether a cleric is needed in a game that also has healing surges.

Here are some posts to illustrate what I mean,
http://www.wizards.com/dnd/article.aspx?x=dnd/4ll/20110426
http://www.wizards.com/DnD/Article.aspx?x=dnd/4ll/20110503#74170
http://lawfulindifferent.blogspot.com/2011/04/god-i-hate-clerics.html
http://daegames.blogspot.com/2011/04/who-wants-to-play-cleric_26.html
http://theresdungeonsdownunder.blogspot.com/2011/05/making-cleric-cleric-blank-religion.html

I am firmly in the camp of Clerics are as much a part of D&D as Fighters, Wizards and Thieves.

My first character ever was Father Johan Weper, Cleric of the God of the Sun, Hunter of the Undead. He was a bit of a generic cleric to be honest, and I choose the sun god because I thought that as a quasi-medieval priest  the sun would be a major feature of all the is holy, bright and good.  Plus I had been reading a bunch of Greek Myths and I though Apollo would make for a good god.  But the real reason I choose the cleric; Turning Undead.  That was an AWESOME power in my pre-teen mind.   So that has colored my views of the cleric ever since.

In real life I am an atheist, but I like the play the religious character.  So clerics, witches, druids, all fascinate me.  But clerics are where it all started.

Clerics as Occult Researchers

In nearly every other game I have ever played there have been occult researchers.  There is usually someone that is the pary's muscle, the magic-guy, the sneaky guy and then the smart guy.  Sometime the magic guy and smart guy are the same, sometimes though they are not.  The Cleric takes on the roll of the Smart Guy or the Occult Researcher.  The books, the ill fitting glasses, and the wisdom to know what to do is the roll of the cleric.

It is fairly well known that the idea behind clerical undead turning  came from Peter Cushing's Van Helsing characters in the various Hammer Dracula films.  Why not extend the metaphor to include the rest of Van Helsing's portfolio.  As a class that puts a high value on Wisdom then the cleric should be a font of knowledge. Sure, this can also be done by the Magic-User / Wiazard,  but the cleric's input should not be understated.

In D&D 3 and 4 knowledge of the undead fall within the Knowledge (Religion) or just Religion category.   These characters tend to have more training in this area than other characters.  While wizards are typically the font of magical knowledge, clerics should be the source of knowledge beyond the ken of mortal man and into the realm of the gods.

Clerics as the Party Leader
The cleric also can serve the roll as the leader. While the cleric can run the gamut of influential high priest to crazy street prophet to diabolic cult leader, players typically take on the roll of the cleric of the local church, usually good.  Certainly that is what D&D4 wants you to do and that is fine.  This type of cleric also works as the default leader, whether he/she is or not. So if this is the hand you are dealt, then play it because clerics make great leaders. Under most circumstances they access to power, money, a hierarchy and can expect a modicum of respect from the locals.  All this adds up to instant authority figure.  Even if they are not.

Cleric as the Party Medic

The obvious role.  Clerics have healing magic in earlier editions of the game, have spontaneous healing spells in the 3.x era and can activate healing surges in 4th.  The role of the cleric cannot be overstated.  Parties with out a cleric die.
During my run between 1st and 2nd Ed I created a Healer class.  It shared a number of features that my Witch class did including the ability to heal by touch as she went up in level.  Completely unneeded in 3.x of course, but in 2nd Ed it was quite a game changer.  I also made an NPC healer a pacifist.  She would never raise a weapon to any creature, unless of course it was undead and then she went all Peter Cushing on them.  But running that class and character (she was the only character I ever made for that class) showed me how important the healing aspect was.  There was not just the regaining hit points, there was the player morale.  Also since the character was an NPC it was easy not to have her fight, but the Players really did everything they could to protect her.

BTW. Her name was Celene Weper and she was the youngest daughter of Father Werper above.  Yes clerics in my world get married and have kids, since it is a life affirming thing.
Plus keep in mind that Clerics as Healers has a long tradition even in our own world.  If ever a character decided to become a pure healing cleric and take an oath of non violence then I would give them XP for every hitpoint cured and a share of combat XP.  I would also give them 2x the starting funds (even though they would give what they don't spend back to the church) to represent the investment their churches/hospitals have made in them.  After all, can't send a healer out into the world with shoddy armor. Reflects bad on their organization.

Clerics as Combatants?
It almost seems counter to the above, but clerics are the second best major class when it comes to fighting.  Only fighters (and their related classes) are better.  The get good saves vs. magic due to their high wisdom, or Will saves for the same reason and their saves are pretty decent to start with.   Plus they have one thing fighters don't have, the  ability to use magic.  So what you say, so can Wizards and even your favorite witch.  Yes, but can they do it in field plate armor?  Clerics can.  Sure they do not get the combat spells the wizard gets, but they have a few good ones too.  Creeping Doom is a nasty little spell for Druids.  Finger of Death and reversed Heal spells can also ruin someone's day.
In games without Paladins, Clerics are the "righteous fist of (their) god".  Wizards don't smite.
Clerics can also be one of the few character types that can actually kill monsters with out the moral hnagups.  Even fighters, who get paid, and thieves, that might be working as assassins, don't get the same kind of "get out of jail free card" as do clerics operating within the doctrines of their faith and church.  Think back to the Crusades and the Inquisition, the faithful got away with murder, torture and even more horrible crimes in the name of their God and the law had little to say about it or were in collusion with them.

Clerics might then be one of the more well rounded characters in the group.

N is for Netbook

Say "Netbook" and today it invokes an image of a cheap micro-laptop with no optical drive and WiFi. Great little invention really. Get them under 100 bucks a pop and the world of education will be changed.

But that is not what I am talking about today.

Once upon a time Netbook meant a collection of various game related material, often originally posted to places like the AD&D LISTSERV or rec.games.frp.dnd on the Usenet.

It is hard to imagine it in today's post OGL and Creative Commons world, but there was a time when putting together a collection of D&D rules and putting them out there for others was a renegade idea.  TSR back in the day came down hard on any posting anything D&D related, despite the fact that D&D material had pretty much been on the internet since the earliest days.  Eventually TSR backed down (a little) and opened up areas for people to share original creations, via FTP sites like MPGN.

As Usenet, Listserves and ftp sites gave way to the World Wide Web, TSR gave way to Wizards of the Coast. Say whatever you want about WotC, they handled the entire internet issue and netbooks much, much better than TSR ever did.

The mid to late 90s was the Golden Age of Netbooks.  The web was growing and people wanted more material to fill their gaming needs.  Sites like Blue Troll, Planet AD&D and Olik's Netbook Archive grew to meet the need of people wanting to get more material.  These sites are still up (and PADND is still active) so you can download some of these forgotten treasures.

Sites like the Kargatane also grew out of a need for more support for a particular setting, in this case Ravenloft, and they began to produce netbooks that rivaled the quality of TSR/WotC.   Other sites like the Vaults of Pandius for Mystara are not only still active, but still producing material all the time.

The OGL in 2000 changed all of that.  Now you didn't need to post thinly veiled allusions to D&D rules, you could use the OGL and the d20 STL and post a "Compatible" product as long as you followed the rules.  There were still some netbooks produced under the OGL, the FANCC produced a large number of netbooks back in 2000 - 2001.  But all in all the Netbook fad shifted.

Now instead of a Netbook you can make a real book. With the OGL you had new rules that you could use and reuse as you needed.  With places like Lulu and DriveThruRPG you could put your creation up for sale even.

The entire OSR community is the spiritual decedent of  not only the Indie RPG movement, but the Netbook one too.

My Witch Netbooks
Of course I have to mention my Witch netbooks.  The first one is something I had started back in the late 80s and expanded on it through out college. It was originally for AD&D 1st Edition, but I shifted it over to AD&D 2nd Ed back around 89-90.  I remember printing my first copy of what I was calling my "Witch Book" back in '92 on a HP Desk Jet 500.  I expanded it more, read more netbooks online and finally on Halloween 1999 I Was going to release it.  I did.  Almost.  My son Liam was born 3 days before that!  I did get it out onto the web, but I followed it up with a second version on Dec. 22.

You can get a copy of "The Complete Netbook of Witches and Warlocks" from Google Docs. Let me know if there is a problem with the link.

A year later we got D&D 3.  I was given the play test files in Feb of 2000 and I picked up my copy of the new Players Handbook on Sept 11, 2000 (I have the receipt still).  I Had begun on my changes to d20 over the summer and with the new game realized I needed to redo the class from the ground up.  I joined the "D&D Community Council" later renamed to the "Fantasy Community Council" so I could get some input/advice on how to best re-do my witch.

I got a lot of help and in 2003 we published "Liber Mysterium: The Netbook of Witches and Warlocks".  You can also get that from Google Docs.

The two books have some material in common, but they are different takes on the same basic archetype.  For example in CNoWW witches are divine spell casters more similar to clerics and in Liber they are arcane ones.  Warlocks, such as they are, are also very different from each other.

Netbooks as a movement may be dead, but their spirit remains strong.

White Plume Mountain, I challenge you to do this!

So.  Been a really busy week for me.  Work. School. Family.

I took a mental health break from it all last night around 8:00pm and was looking through all my material for the White Plume Mountain and I realized something.

Edition wars are fundamentally bullshit.

The concept of an "edition war" is based on the idea that one edition of a game is better/worse than another.
My running of White Plume Mountain flies in the face of this.

Here are the materials I am using:

Rule base: D&D 3.0 (not 3.5, just 3.0).
Module: White Plume Mountain, 1st Ed AD&D, with 3rd Ed D&D updates and an extension, Dragotha's Lair, written for 2nd Ed. AD&D.
Characters: A Pathfinder Ranger, a 3.5 ed Paladin that is a 4e race (Dragonborn), a 3.0 witch, a couple of converted elemental sorcerers (were M&M 2ed, now Pathfinder), and a Star Wars revised ed bounty hunter.
Dragotha (Big Bad 1): D&D 4e stats from the Draconomicon.
Keraptis (Big Bad 2): BASIC D&D Witch that I am playtesting.
Plus I am using D&D 4e fortune cards.
Also maps released under GSL and minis from at least 5 or 6 different sources (which are all of course edition-free).

Everything so far has run nice and smooth and everyone is having a blast.

So.  Either I am some Mad Scientist, Super-Genius-level DM that can make all these conversions on the fly  OR there is just not as many differences between these systems as some people think.

You may not like a particular edition, but that doesn't actually devalue it nor change it's worth to others.

Anyone else out there do this kind of D&D freestyle mixing of editions?  What were your experiences?  Did it work? Did it fail miserably?  If none of the above would you be interested in trying it out?

Played some AD&D 2nd Ed today.

Got home from half-day at work today and sat down and played some old-school AD&D 2nd Ed today.  My oldest wanted to try it out (I bought him a 2nd ed Monstrous Manual years ago so he wouldn't mess up mine).

Odd how it happened really, we were going to play D&D 4e Red Box, then it was going to be D&D Basic Red Box.  Finally landed on 2nd Ed.  Spent some time, though not as much as I thought, looking up some rules.  Spent more time just figuring out where I put the XP table for my witch.

It was a fun quick little dungeon crawl, no plot, no backstory, just kicking in doors and killing monsters.  Used some 4e minis and the map from the Dungeons & Dragons' Black Box.

All in all a good bit of fun. Doubt we will continue with 2nd Ed, but it was nice to give is a another try.

Is 2nd Ed the next wave of OSR?

I posted a couple days back on the growing 2nd Ed AD&D love I have been seeing on the net and in the blogs. Not a lot of it mind you, more like a few vocal people in a crowd still going on about how the LBBs are the "best thang evar!"  (Ok for the record NO one has ever actually said that, that way.)

But the OSR movement has slowed down to stead pace now and we are not getting Yet Another OD&D Clone this month and I think people are giving 2nd Ed another look.

I have mentioned in that past that 2nd Ed is the game I ran the most but hardly ever played.  I was very much a DM only with that game.  In fact I was one of the early adopters of the game, buying it on the day it came out and not even taking any of my 1st Ed books with me back to college.  But sometime in the late 90's that (and I) changed.  When 2nd Ed came out I was a single college kid, living in the dorms and surviving on the the money I made tutoring others in math and physics. When 3rd Ed came out I was married, living in a house with a brand new baby and just laid off my teaching job because the grant funding at the university dried up.   I was two completely different people.    In the middle I nearly gave up on D&D all together and even sold off 80% of my collection in favor of games like "WitchCraft RPG" and "Vampire" and other horror games.  All that I have left now for 2nd ed is the three cores, the Celts guide and some Ravenloft stuff.  Though the PHB and DMG are my originals and I got them the day they were rel

Why is any of that important?  It's important because it has permanently colored how I view AD&D 2nd Ed. for years.  I did remember the joy of the getting the latest Monstrous Compendium supplement, I only recalled the dreck of the Skills and Powers books.

But as time goes on and I wax on about earlier systems it is only natural that eventually my rose colored glasses gaze on 2nd Ed. Others seem to be doing the same.

2nd Ed as a retro-clone though has some issues it must deal with first.
- First, 2nd Ed is mechanically not all that different from 1st Ed.  One could in theory play a "2nd Ed Game" with nothing more than OSRIC.  One of the big selling points behind 2nd Ed was it re-organized the material from earlier editions.  It is in a sense the first Retro-clone.
- What made 2nd Ed special to many were the campaign worlds, and those don't fall under the OGL at all.  Plus most of the OSR folks seem to prefer sandbox worlds so anything created by them would naturally fit into any other world.
- The Proficiency system of 2nd Ed is needlessly complicated.  Note I am not saying it is complicated itself, it's not, but it is more complicated than it needs to be for a game.  3rd Ed's Skill system is superior in nearly every respect, and 4th Ed's is better still.  Reverse engineering it would not be difficult (premise, not every skill is worth the same amount) but I'd have to ask why?

The monster's in 2nd Ed were a nice improvement over 1st ed. I like the one monster per page format, something that 3rd ed dropped but 4th ed picked back up.

Personally I think it is only a matter of time before someone does a full on 2nd Ed clone.  I know there are some in development now.   I know of and have looked at the beta of Adventures Dark and Deep, a sort of "what-if game", as in what if Gygax had developed AD&D 2nd ED the way he had planned.

2nd Edition lives on!

The 2nd Edition of the World's Largest Fantasy Role-playing game is often the World's Most Forgotten Fantasy Role-Playing game.
While 1st Ed AD&D continues to get all sorts of gushy love and the border skirmishes between 3rd and 4th are still going on, 2nd Ed often gets forgotten.

But not by these guys.

PurpleWorm.org is a site dedicated to 2nd Edition AD&D.  Full of content.
http://www.purpleworm.org/content/

THAC0 Forever! Is a AD&D 2nd ed centric Blog.
http://add2e.blogspot.com/

Planet AD&D (where I used to be a contributor) is going on 12+ years of providing D&D material for readers.  It was primarily a 2nd Ed site, but now it caters to many flavors of D&D.
http://www.padnd.com/

I used to work on Planet AD&D and there is still some content there that belonged on my original The Other Side website.

I have talked about my experiences with 2nd Ed in the past, but today just reflect on what was good about this, the most dismissed of all the Editions.